VWDieselParts.com

[hagar]

SAGA : wolf_walker bravo you are getting there., to verify that hagar is not full (completely) of bovine tips.

go to the BOSCH Bible.. More than not I am trying to explain , BUT remember this is not my Mother toungue .

WHY ? do I say "COMPLICATED" so many times ? answer there are Kazillion variables..

The way the governor moves the control collar is NOT proportional to pedal movement.. From a steady state say at 50 mph even a slight push on pedal and collar goes to full load., then retracts to a new steady state is reached..

We do not have any way of variing the mixture with the so called "RIGHT FOOT" read my lips.

Ok, somebody devise a test and figure this out. If the guy can post a video of a cutaway pump running to show governor action surely someone here can come up with something to settle this.

Those cut open pumps to see the internals move are nice. I have seen many over the years..

hagar.

[hagar]

SAGA : Op-Ivy and ALL :. your options on MIXTURE are unlimited. SO ? how do you know when your nice Jetta is in super lean ? Pull the airline from manifold to LDA , now you are in ECO mode. .Then you turn full load stop screw counter clockwise to she will not do any more than 50 km/h with pedal to the metal. THAT is super lean. . A better setting is say 80 km/h .

hagar.

PS : did you install the glow plug fuse I gave you ? if not DO IT.

[hagar]

SAGA : mattbondy , said However, ignoring volumetric efficiency is probably pretty reasonable . correct.

At this time we are talking about how to adjust MIXTURE . entering volumetric's would only muddy the waters.

That discussion comes under advansed and brings in the Turbo.

hagar.

[wolf_walker]

[libbybapa]

[wolf_walker]

I didn't say it was nice, just that it is. People are people, grok?
And note when I say mixture it's "mixture". Difference. I'm not arguing against you exactly. Your presentation of the fact is rough though.
l talk to people about cars all day, five days a week, for the last ten years, to talk them out of there money and into having there car working and them happy(sometimes despite themselves). And this isn't Honda's and cheap autozone parts, this is expensive European junk and (mostly) not stupid owners. If I have to dumb something down to get the above goals accomplished, it will be done. I prefer a functional understanding in a person rather than an incorrect principal understanding. As an extreme and sexist example, you've tried explaining car stuff to a woman with no background? Isn't it better to just say look, when this light comes on, STOP. You don't have to give them a course in cooling or lubrication systems. It isn't nice or pretty and I don't intend you stop preaching about the absence of mixture adjustment, just understand why the idea "works" in people's heads.

Re: timing/atoms
I wasn't thinking throttle lever changing timing, but I do think if you have reduced max fuel quantity enough one would tend to rev the motor higher, which changes timing. So does temperature, fuel viscosity, who knows what else. Say ole Joe-Blow who has now cranked down max fuel on his pump see's it's not smoking anymore and thinks, huh, neat, now I can give it more "gas", and does so. RPM=timing. Much difference? Maybe, maybe not, if my observation about most tired pumps is true none of them are advancing much as they should anyway.
I think it's important to understand why people come to conclusions that they do, especially if they are wrong. Any teacher will tell you it does not work to say flat out "no you are wrong it's this".

The term "fueling goals" is pretty damn funny for some reason. I always just drove the damn things.
_________________
81 Caddy D, 601K
73 Mercedes 280
82 Rabbit LS D

[libbybapa]

WRT atoms/timing, I stated for a given speed (engine speed) and load the "mixture" does not affect either atomization or timing. Yes, if you change the speed it will. If you are running 5,000 rpms in 4th gear vs. 2,500 in 5th it will indeed change the timing of injection and fuel consumption. I wouldn't ever imply otherwise.

[wolf_walker]

[libbybapa]

Everything that I have come to know about the pumps and presented here is practical to tuning them and driving them. I am not speaking about theory that does not apply to everyday real-world practical experience. I am speaking about a practical understanding backed up by considerable firsthand experience.

[wolf_walker]

[Fatmobile]

I get what libbybapa is saying. Given a certain pump. The foot controls the level of smoke, reguardless of how the pump is adjusted,.. as long as the max fuel screw (the one that sets the max amount of fuel available when floored at any given RPM) is set to provide enough.

I'm not sure what wolf_walker is saying.
I mean I understand the part about backing off when you are getting no more power out of it,.. that's an example of what Andrew is saying.
Driver controls the mixture.

I also see what you mean when someone backs off the max fuel screw and gets better fuel mileage,.. because the driver's foot controls the mix and that driver wasn't doing it right.

I'm not sure where you are both disagreeing.

I had always thought the more air in the mix, the better the fuel mileage.
A major point Andrew is making is that isn't true.
I'm changing that view after what Andrew has posted.
Pumping in more air until the exhaust is clean doesn't mean it is running at it's most efficient zone.
wolf_walker, do you agree that more air in the mix doesn't mean more efficiency?
_________________
'91 Golf gasser converted to turbo diesel.
'83 Rabbit gasser, converted to diesel, then converted to run on vegetable oil.
2, '84 GTI projects cars

[hagar]

SAGA : Op-Ivy said : I'm going to try tuning my car
for maximum smileage soon. Hagar, what is your opinion on fueling? I've
heard that leaning the fuel out too much can will give you less lower end
grunt, resulting in the need to use higher rpm more often.

Your engine is rated 68 HP by VW . running LEAN HP is a
product of RPM and Torque SO ? to get maximum power in lean you must
increase RPM , easy to do., and yes shifting gears is normal way to do
it..

Experi,ment by juggling Load stop and Idle screws.

hagar.

[wolf_walker]

[Fatmobile]

Someone decided disagreeing with Hagar was a bad thing and sent a nasty PM to Andrew. Something about picking on an ill old man
There will no longer be anyone telling us that way overinflating your tires is a bad idea.
No one to say more air doesn't mean more efficiency.
There will be no more checks and balances,..
you will only be allowed to hear one side,..
or half of one side in some cases.
...and be forwarned; if you decide to disagree with Hagar someone might send you a nasty PM, doesn't matter if you are right
I'm not sure who it was,.. maybe they won't be too ashamed to admit it.
Andrew won't be posting here anymore,..
and I don't want to get a nasty IM so I won't be disagreeing with anything on this post either.
You'll have to sort the truth out yourselves.
Censorship works in many ugly ways
_________________
'91 Golf gasser converted to turbo diesel.
'83 Rabbit gasser, converted to diesel, then converted to run on vegetable oil.
2, '84 GTI projects cars

[bscutt]

That is unfortunate to say the least. Andrew contributed all sorts of excellent information to this forum. The debates and conversations between participants on this forum is what helps sort out the good technical information.

Too bad someone did not grasp the importance of free speech. Hagar always holds his own and never seems to have any issues with others disagreeing with him. I believe he also fully understands the importance of different viewpoints and experiences.
_________________
Bob

'06 Jetta TDI
'79 Rabbit 1.5NA
'82 Rabbit 1.6NA
'90 Corrado G60, 86 AMC Eagle, 88 Corolla
Honda, F150, S10 Blazer, '41 Chevy Coupe